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Stop using Discord


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Yeah, the big reason why discord was the go-to(other than existant popularity with the gaming scene) is the featureset.


Being able to do quick-invite links, web or dedicated app, basically permanent history. multiple channels in the same server for easy-to-use navigation. notifications, file embedding, image/video in-window viewing, and on and on.


It's a lot of really good, useful features especially for when development talk gets heavy that vanilla IRC just doesn't at all hold a candle to.


I'm unfamiliar with Rocketchat or Matrix, so those could potentially be good alternatives, but to suggest going back to basic IRC doesn't really jive, imo given how supremely useful the featureset is towards productivity(let alone community fun).

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@JeffR

Yes, it may be "convenient" but that is not what it is about, we are an open source project, so we are not about convenience in the first place anyway, people who want convenience will not use our engine, but use some more convenient engine and to make it even more convenient, buy all their stuff in the asset store instead of developing it themselves, thats the future of convenience.


Convenience for me is kind of a synonym for ignorance.


By the way almost all the advantages you named are nonexistent, the only valid one I see is embedding files/video, everything else you can have with IRC as well, depending on your client, but in most clients you can set it up like that as well, that you have a history, notifications for anything you want etc.


There are also a lot of disadvantages that discord brings, like being proprietary, having to register, having to install potential malware/spyware on your computer, getting data harvested, getting ads for payments they want from you, since the program is not really free etc.

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It is just not sinking in duion, no one is forcing you to use discord, just look at how many replies and views your ranting threads have received, discord is just another option people have to discuss things related to t3d, there is no mandatory requirement to use it.


I have said this multiple times already, if you don't want to use discord that is fine, just don't sit there and tell the rest of community what software we are allowed to use because of your own ideological (yet hypocritical) views.

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@Duion do correct me if i am wrong, but the only link i can find to discord is within these actual forums. There is no link that i noticed to discord on the landing page for this community (torque3d.org), there is only a link to the forums (via Community->Forums). Than once you reach the forums, yes there is a link to discord but i don't see how you could say that is the only way to communicate, the link certainly doesn't say anything like that & obviously here i am (and others) replying to you right now in these very forums (not that i am a steering committee member anyway). As i mentioned before, if you want an IRC channel or whatever dedicated to t3d, create one and i'm sure a mod would be happy to provide a link to it.

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Discord is the only way to communicate aside from the forum, which is hardly ever used by anyone, since anyone is just using Discord for anything and never before was any other way of communicating advertised on the forum or by people, not even the IRC channel when it still existed, it existed kind of in the shadows.

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Just gonna put this out there. The only reason we are promoting Discord, is because of its popularity within the community.


Should a new communication channel arise that are just as popular, it will of course get featured in the same way Discord is.


The forums website is in no way favoring Discord over alternatives.


Edit: inb4 there was no IRC link.

The Discord link came up after IRC went down, and it was requested by Discord users.

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  • 3 months later...

If there is interest we are currently working on a Mattermost based team-chat for interested open source game projects https://chat.freegamedev.net

Mattermost offers a lot of neat devops integrations such as https://github.com/mattermost/mattermost-plugin-github


We also have a Matterbridge running that could bridge to the existing Discord and IRC chats.


However, I have to say that Duion is currently banned on our network due to excessive trolling :) I might be willing to give him a third? chance though :p


P.S. we also have a new Gitea based code hosting repository: git.freegamedev.net

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@Julius

This forum is for game developers using Torque3D, you are neither a game developer nor are you using Torque3D.


Why would I as game developer using Torque3D want to be a member of a game development community where nobody is a game developer or using Torque3D?


PS: Bridging Discord chats is even more stupid and dangerous than using Discord by itself, since you just spread the infection.

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@Duion

Bringing more people in the game development space into the T3D community where they may find the game engine they've been looking for is hardly a bad idea.


Calling other communities an "infection" is pretty impressively rude and I'd ask you don't do that again.


If we bring T3D and our community to their attention and they choose to not utilize the engine, that's their call but it hardly makes them 'diseased'.


Incidentally, I have recently drafted a Code of Conduct in the announcement subforum, stickied. I would recommend that you give it a read over.

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@JeffR

"Infection" was meant metaphorically and it was related to Discord.


I explain it for you once again in a bit more detail, if you don't understand the short reference:


You don't solve the Discord problem by bridging other services to it, since that makes it even worse than using Discord itself, since you infect other services with the problems that Discord brings and you end up with using two services that are as bad as Discord, since everything is now routed through it. It is like a hostile takeover where the liberal platform gets taken over by the non liberal one.


Just learn to read, I did not talk about anything you think I was talking about.

You now wrote a Code of Conduct because of a nonexistent issue, great job.

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Ok, so I'm kinda jumping into this SUPER late and have no sort of desire to read through all 4 pages of conversation that have happened. My thoughts may hold no value in this. I do not see a reason to just totally drop discord though. Yeah, it's not opensource, not everything HAS to be. Yes, it's nice when things are opensource, but most people like getting paid when they put work into something. We could just use both, not exclude people who have dogmatic beliefs about these sorts of things.

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Ok, so I'm kinda jumping into this SUPER late and have no sort of desire to read through all 4 pages of conversation that have happened.

 

Well you should at least have read the initial thread so you know what it is about. I explained my arguments already so you better read them before you answer. It is not about dogmatism at all.

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I know I should not engage in discussions with you, but you have again no idea what you are talking about :p

A bridge does not move everything to Discord, the opposite is the case, i.e. everything is moved off Discord and they only retain a tiny fraction of the user data that they currently get. Of course you could argue that it makes it easier to stay on Discord, but lets face the truth here... the majority of people will stay there for the time being. But at least with the bridge they have a good alternative available.

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I know I should not engage in discussions with you, but you have again no idea what you are talking about :p

A bridge does not move everything to Discord, the opposite is the case, i.e. everything is moved off Discord and they only retain a tiny fraction of the user data that they currently get. Of course you could argue that it makes it easier to stay on Discord, but lets face the truth here... the majority of people will stay there for the time being. But at least with the bridge they have a good alternative available.

 

That is a good alternative kind of get the best of both worlds. Kind of off topic but your game packs on opengameart are amazing love the attention to detail in them

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That is a good alternative kind of get the best of both worlds. Kind of off topic but your game packs on opengameart are amazing love the attention to detail in them

No you don't get the best of both worlds, this is totally irrational, you are just extending the data harvesting to infect open source platforms as well, so you are making it worse overall.

He also does not have any game packs on Opengameart, most of his stuff is from other people, he just uploaded it and even most of the few things he made are unfinished prototypes, but he does not even pretend that it is his stuff, he correctly names the authors who made the stuff he uploaded, you just failed to read.

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@NekoDemon117

No I'm just trying to prevent people here from wrecking everything. Discord is a hostile corporate takeover and you should not go along with it, especially not as an open source project and especially not without asking anyone and especially not making it the only exclusive communication platform. I mean how often am I supposed to repeat my arguments? Are you not able to process logic reasoning?

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No. Guess what? Not everyone is on the software political train. In fact most people are not. I love open source software and projects, I love supporting them and using them. I do not use them exclusively, nor have I ever done so, nor will I ever do so. I use tools to get a job done, not to make a software political statement. Nothing is being "infected" that is a ridiculously silly statement. I use visual studio. I bought torque when it was not open source. I use many proprietary pieces of software to get my tasks done, I do not care if it is open source or not.


The fact I have to "register" to use discord does not bother me at all. It is currently the most popular service, everyone uses it from gamers to developers, it has a massively wide install base, it is easy to use. Stop telling people what to use or not use, it is none of your business, if you want to use something else, as many have said nothing is stopping you from doing so. Perhaps instead of complaining here you could have spent that time and energy to setup the IRC server your championing so fervently.

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@XIXWYRMEXIX


We had an IRC channel before and you can create a new IRC channel within minutes, for example Freenode offers free hosting for open source projects since like forever, which almost all open source projects also used since almost forever. An IRC channel was deliberately not created and even before deliberately not advertised anywhere, so it was not well known.


It is also not about open source or political statements it is about complete ignorance, one person just decides "We do everything on discord now, screw everything that was before" without asking anyone and if you complain you are just told "fuck off". There is actually a long list of reasons why not to use discord and "open source" and "political statements" are at the very bottom of those lists for the most part. The whole business model is abusing it's customers and scamming them and the popularity was created through dubious methods like bribing youtubers etc to advertise it. But I already made many of the arguments, I'm tried of repeating them over and over, it would be much easier if you could read the arguments to begin with and make counter arguments based on that, but attacking me personally all the time does not get us anywhere.


Here are some more reasons not do use Discord: https://spyware.neocities.org/articles/discord.html


I also updated the main post to include that link as well, since it is much more detailed than the first link I posted.

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  • 1 month later...

As an open source project, we should have an open source friendly chat platform as well, like IRC, almost any open source project is there, just not us.

 

Same goes with Discord, I cannot stop people from using Discord, but I was suggesting to not use Discord as the primary and exclusive way of communication, you can have it as an alternative, but do not advertise it as the main and only way and tell everyone else that does not want to use it to fuck off.

 


in case you missed the title of the thread its :-

Stop using Discord



 

Popularity is not an argument

o'rly?

 

almost any open source project is there, just not us.

 

You may think you made an argument, but you did not. My argument is not based on popularity, but based on reason and the reason is, for example if you play golf, you go to golf clubs, because that is where golf players are, you don't go to soccer clubs, just because your friend says soccer is much more popular. Discord is made for gamers and advertised to gamers and freenode IRC is made for open source developers and advertised to open source developers. Platforms dedicated to open source are almost never more popular than others, since it is a very small target group. My main argument is however that Discord is not open source friendly, but straightforward hostile towards it as well as hostile towards their own users in several other ways.


Of course most people probably do not understand basic reasoning and common sense, but I tried to make my argument clear once more for the last time, if people still don't get it, it is hopeless for them.

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